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Let’s All Just Let It Flow

“Climb the moun­tains and get their good tid­ings. Nature’s peace will flow into you as sun­shine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own fresh­ness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop off like autumn leaves.” ~ John Muir

Today, it is an honor to share with you another inter­view with one of our reg­u­lar read­ers here at the Jun­gle of Life — Stacey Ship­man, whose blog, Let It Flow, is a source of much inspi­ra­tion in the areas of health, well­ness, and per­sonal growth.  What I par­tic­u­larly like about Stacey is that she is not afraid to express her opin­ion, and often that leaves me with much to think about as I read the words she shares — both in her own blog posts, as well as in her well thought out com­ments she leaves here.  She writes from the heart, and isn’t afraid to open up and really share her­self and her expe­ri­ences.  A recent exam­ple is, Mind vs. Body: Never Give Up and Adven­tures in Rock Climb­ing.  Stop over and check out what she’s talk­ing about!

And with that, please help me in wel­com­ing Stacey here today!

I ask her the tough ques­tions, and Stacey answers them with poise and grace…

1. Tell us a lit­tle bit about who “you” are (fam­ily, career, any spe­cial life expe­ri­ences you’d like to share, etc.)

I am a Mass­a­chu­setts native cur­rently liv­ing 12 miles south of Boston with my hus­band Michael and my two “boys” — Mr. Bob and Habibi (our cats).  I spent 10 years as a mar­ket research pro­fes­sional before leav­ing the cor­po­rate world to start my own “thing”.   I spe­cial­ize in mak­ing stress relief easy and prac­ti­cal.  I still very much use my mar­ket research skills and am grate­ful to have them.

Every expe­ri­ence is an oppor­tu­nity to learn about myself, and some of my most mem­o­rable expe­ri­ences include run­ning marathons in Boston qual­i­fy­ing times, hik­ing and camp­ing in the Grand Canyon, zip lin­ing in the rain for­est of Costa Rica and fire­walk­ing.  Each of those adven­tures helped me develop the belief that I can pretty much do any­thing I put my mind to.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: You’ve had some very excit­ing expe­ri­ences — fire­walk­ing, that one sounds painful!  The Grand Canyon trip — that one’s on my list of things to do.

2. How long have you been blog­ging, and what led you to start writing?

I’ve been blog­ging for almost 2 years, although blog­ging with pur­pose for almost 1.  I started blog­ging to:

1) Increase web pres­ence for my business

2) Get my thoughts out.  I have a lot of infor­ma­tion that can help peo­ple and I wanted to share it.  Now blog­ging helps fuel my pro­grams, speak­ing top­ics and prod­uct ideas.

3. Health and well­ness are a big part of your “story”.  Can you tell us about your journey?

My well­ness jour­ney started in col­lege when I gained the fresh­man 15.  I was shop­ping for jeans one day and the Levi’s sales­woman said to me, “Let me get you a pair of our 550s, they are a lit­tle fuller through the hips.”  I started exer­cis­ing 60 to 90 min­utes, 5 to 7 days a week, and car­ried a calo­rie counter with me. I lost 30 lbs and ended up with mono.  The ill­ness led me to seek out infor­ma­tion so I could more effec­tively man­age my weight and my health.  My pas­sion was born.  I became an aer­o­bics instruc­tor and fit­ness trainer part time and in 2005 became a cer­ti­fied yoga instructor.

The jour­ney hasn’t always been easy or healthy.  With the pas­sion came the obses­sion.  I worked out 2 hours a day, and changed or declined plans in order to fit in a work­out. When faced with fear pro­vok­ing sit­u­a­tions, I exer­cised to avoid it.  Only within the last cou­ple of years did I real­ize this obses­sion was a problem.

I remain active daily and now I am more in tune with the needs of my body.  Some­times I need a run and some­times I need to relax.  That aware­ness has made all the dif­fer­ence in my health and well-being.  My expe­ri­ence cou­pled with edu­ca­tion is the basis for my pas­sion of help­ing oth­ers live life well, bal­anced and less stressed.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: I love your hon­esty here Stacey.  It’s not always easy for any of us.  Hear­ing what oth­ers have been through to get where they are is not only inspi­ra­tional, but gives hope.  Thank you for being so open about the jour­ney you’ve been on.

4. You’ve made the switch from the cor­po­rate world to work­ing for your­self.  What advice would you give some­one look­ing to make this leap?

Based on my own experience:

  • Work on your­self first — I needed to fig­ure out where my fear came from
  • Get rid of the F word — Fail­ure.  It’s a learn­ing expe­ri­ence, not a failure.
  • Be resilient — when you do “fail”, you have to pick your­self up and keep going.  Don’t get stuck in what went “wrong”. Learn from it!
  • Have patience — Prob­a­bly the most chal­leng­ing!  We all want imme­di­ate results.  Slow and steady…
  • Get sup­port — Even if you are start­ing a busi­ness on your own (like me) there are sup­port net­works avail­able — coach­ing, net­work­ing groups, friends, advi­sory boards.

Bonus:  Be flex­i­ble.  The only thing I know for sure is that change hap­pens.  I am not in the same place I was 3 years ago or doing the same things.  I have done noth­ing but evolve and change — per­son­ally and pro­fes­sion­ally.  Allow it to hap­pen, it’s actu­ally very freeing!

5. One of the things I know you’re pas­sion­ate about is yoga.  In a few sen­tences, can you tell us the real ben­e­fits we can achieve by adding yoga into our well­ness activities?

Yoga is a prac­tice you need to expe­ri­ence your­self to truly under­stand. (5 or 10 min­utes a day is all you need to real­ize ben­e­fits).   That said I’ve expe­ri­enced the fol­low­ing ben­e­fits:  Peace of mind, less stress, less phys­i­cal and emo­tional ten­sion, a more pos­i­tive way of think­ing and liv­ing, a new per­spec­tive, greater con­fi­dence, greater strength and flex­i­bil­ity (both phys­i­cally and mentally).

I’ll be writ­ing more about yoga on my blog because I really believe in the practice.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: Stay tuned to her web­site, Let It Flow, this will be good stuff!

6. What do you see as the real pur­pose of your blog (in other words, why do you write)?

I write because I have some­thing to say and I write with the pur­pose of help­ing peo­ple think in a way they may not be used to.  Whether online or in per­son, I love to chal­lenge peo­ple.  I don’t nec­es­sar­ily want peo­ple to agree with me. I do insist, how­ever on mutual respect, espe­cially when it comes to any differences.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: I recall being chal­lenged by you on more than one occa­sion.  And it’s all good!

7. Tell me one unex­pected thing that has hap­pened because of your blog.

The com­mu­nity of peo­ple I “met”.

8. If you had to pick one thing as your great­est achieve­ment, what would it be (and why)?

I was recently asked about my proud­est moments and I rat­tled off 5!  If I have to choose only one…

The risk I took when I quite my cor­po­rate job and the fact that nearly 3 years later I’m still going strong.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: There is a def­i­nite risk in leav­ing some­thing that is steady, for the unknown of being out on your own.  I com­mend you, Stacey, on mak­ing this leap, and con­grat­u­late you on the suc­cess you’ve expe­ri­enced.  This is a great exam­ple to all of us on what is pos­si­ble if we believe in ourselves!

9. You’ve done sev­eral pieces of work using both audio and video.  Can you tell us about this, it’s ben­e­fits, and what you’ve learned along the way?

  • My ulti­mate goal is to be a media per­son­al­ity — TV or radio — I enjoy both!
  • Allows me to share infor­ma­tion to a wider audi­ence.  I espe­cially love inter­view­ing other people.
  • Nice sup­ple­ment to my writ­ing and serve as a great cre­ative outlet.
  • Great way to make busi­ness and pro­fes­sional con­tacts.  Look­ing for­ward to shar­ing more with a new web­site in 2009.
  • Great busi­ness mar­ket­ing tool allow­ing you to show­case your exper­tise and abil­i­ties as a prac­ti­tioner, speaker, etc.

Lance’s Com­men­tary: Once you’re famous and have your own national TV show, remem­ber you got your start right here!!  Okay, on a more seri­ous note, you are dream­ing big.  And what bet­ter way to achieve what you really want than to dream it, and then share it with oth­ers.  Go Stacey!

10. It’s good to sep­a­rate from work — and do other activ­i­ties.  What are your out­lets?  What do these other activ­i­ties add to your life?

I feel for­tu­nate that I love well­ness — as work and as a per­sonal activ­ity, but well­ness aside.…

I love jig­saw puz­zles, watch­ing Will Fer­rell movies (affin­ity for Old School!), Latin and belly danc­ing, rock climb­ing, cook­ing, adven­ture travel, spend­ing time at the arcade with my niece and nephew, and more recently tak­ing stand up com­edy classes.

My favorite activ­ity is sit­ting on the deck or by the fire (depend­ing on the sea­son) sip­ping a glass of wine and have great con­ver­sa­tion with my hus­band, Michael.  Or kick­ing his butt in back­yard badminton!

Lance’s Com­men­tary: The next time we’re in Boston, I’m com­ing over!  Since my wife likes to “beat” me at all things sports (my claim is that I let her win, but maybe that’s an exag­ger­a­tion) — we’ll play men vs. women dou­bles bad­minton — that way I’ll have some­one to com­mis­er­ate with!  And we can close with a good Will Fer­rell movie — I’m think­ing “Kick­ing and Scream­ing”… which I might be doing after the bad­minton tour­na­ment!

Clos­ing Thoughts: Stacey, it’s been a plea­sure hav­ing you here today.  You did fab­u­lous, and it’s been great to get to know you bet­ter!  You are a real source of inspi­ra­tion, have a heart of gold, and have been a great addi­tion to the won­der­ful com­mu­nity we have here.  Thank you, again, for shar­ing your­self with all of us!

Lance writes sto­ries from his heart, aim­ing to inspire and moti­vate, as you align more fully with YOUR true peak. When he’s not here, you can find him hang­ing out with his fam­ily, rid­ing a bike, or just gen­er­ally act­ing goofy.   Sign up for the Thoughts from the Tree­house newslet­ter and get addi­tional inspi­ra­tion in your email inbox!
Lance Ekum
View all posts by Lance Ekum

Comments

  1. Hi Lance and Stacey — What a beau­ti­ful and insight­ful inter­view. I love how Stacey had faith in her­self to quit the cor­po­rate world and ven­ture out on her own. I also like how she shared to be patient when start­ing a busi­ness. From expe­ri­ence, I know this to be the truth. Suc­cess does not hap­pen overnight.

    Bar­bara Swaf­ford — Blog­ging With­out A Blog´s last blog post..NBOTW — I Think I Can, I Think I Can

  2. After read­ing this post, I feel so low and shal­low. So much to catch up, so many things I have to learn

    sud­denly slimmer´s last blog post..Wishes Flown Away

  3. Evelyn Lim says:

    Stacey sure sounds very sporty like you, Lance!! I enjoy read­ing blogs that keep me inspired about being fit!! It’s tempt­ing to sit here in front of my lap­top all day but read­ing your blogs remind me to get off my butt and to stick to my reg­u­lar exer­cise sched­ule! Fire­walk­ing is some­thing that will be off my menu though!!

    Eve­lyn Lim´s last blog post..Whose Pain Is This?

  4. Dot says:

    Lance, thanks for intro­duc­ing us to Stacey and her blog. It’s one I hadn’t run across before. Stacey, it sounds like you cer­tainly do have a lot to share with peo­ple, and I’m look­ing for­ward to read­ing more on your blog, when I get caught up with my blog read­ing, which I had to set aside for a while.

    That’s a beau­ti­ful quo­ta­tion from John Muir and says a lot of what I believe about the power of nature.

    Dot´s last blog post..In Paxil I Trust

  5. Hi

    Great to see some­one so pas­sion­ate about so many dif­fer­ent areas of life. Thank you for shar­ing Stacey! And thanks for a great inter­view Lance!

    Juliet

    Life­Made­Great | Juliet´s last blog post..Over­com­ing the Bar­ri­ers of Intro­ver­sion: What To Look For in a Life Coach?

  6. I became an instant fan of Stacey Ship­man from the moment I read her blog and learned about her life pas­sions. Her pos­i­tive energy is con­ta­gious and her abil­ity to con­nect to oth­ers is inspiring.

    Stacey / Cre­ate a Balance´s last blog post..Why Focus on Life Balance?

  7. Resilience, Patience and Sup­port. SO TRUE. Great inter­view, Lance. It’s a plea­sure to get to know you bet­ter, Stacey.

  8. Lance says:

    @Barbara — Thanks — it was all Stacey!! Faith is a big thing when ven­tur­ing out on your own — Stacey is a great exam­ple of this in action.

    @Suddenly Slim­mer — The thing is, Alia, we’re all at dif­fer­ent spots in our life. And yet, we have the power within us — to change. If that’s what we need to do. There is so much for us all to learn out there. And that’s okay. The thing is, you acknowl­edge that there is much you don’t know — and in so doing — you’re poised well ahead of most. That’s a great first step!

    @Evelyn — Who’s the sporty one — aren’t you get­ting all set to do some ski­ing? I’ll take it, though (it has a nice ring!) — and yes, Stacey fits that mold too! Now, you’re also remind­ing me to get up and do some exercise…soon! Fire­walk­ing — I really want to know more about this! Stacey?

    @Dot — Stacey is pretty awe­some, I think you’ll enjoy her writ­ing very much!

    @LifeMadeGreat | Juliet — Stacey touches upon the many areas of well­ness — my first thought is the phys­i­cal aspect — but there’s so much more to it. Check out her writ­ing, where you’ll really see her pas­sion shine through!

    @Stacey/Create A Bal­ance — It’s prob­a­bly the name, right?? There was an instant con­nec­tion! Stacey (the Ship­man vari­ety) is loads of pos­i­tive energy — I feel that same thing read­ing her — not all that dif­fer­ent from Stacey (the Cre­ate A Bal­ance variety).

    @Vered — Great points that Stacey makes about going out on her own. Thanks Vered!

  9. Sagan says:

    Great inter­view!

    I love zip lin­ing. And I think that many/most peo­ple who dis­cover a real pas­sion for health– or any­thing, for that mat­ter– expe­ri­ence a point when they become obses­sive about it. It’s good to rec­og­nize that and get back on track!

  10. Laurie says:

    Great inter­view Lance! I too want to do the Grand Canyon. I want to white water raft while I’m there. I could also go for the rain­for­est zip-line. Life is too short to not have some adve­tures. I think I’ll start that soon. (eeek)

  11. Annette says:

    Stacey is an inspi­ra­tion! The quote at the begin­ning is beau­ti­ful :) .….….I’d like to bot­tle that feel­ing :)

    Annette´s last blog post..I MADE IT!!!!!

  12. This inter­view is very refresh­ing and real. Nice work Lance and Stacey.

    Tom Volkar / Delight­ful Work´s last blog post..Dou­ble Your Income Next Year

  13. Jannie says:

    I sure like what Stacey says about strik­ing the F — Fail­ure word from our vocab­u­lar­ies. There is no fail­ure. There is only “not try.” And she sure embod­ies the mean­ing of not only try, but succedd!

    Thanks, Lance.

    Jannie´s last blog post..Ten Hon­est Things

  14. Stacy sounds like a cool woman. She’s doing what I want to do, but not quite there yet. I’ve added her to my fee­dreader and hope to get some good tips on leav­ing the cor­po­rate world for my own business.

    Karl — Work Happy Now´s last blog post..Day 8 of 30 — No Complaining

  15. @Lance– Thank you for high­light­ing me today! I feel over­whelmed by everyone’s com­ments… thank you for the opportunity!

    @Barbara — Faith and sup­port– belief in your­self is an absolute must, and that exter­nal sup­port, specif­i­cally from my hus­band was crit­i­cal as well. He believes in me, too and know­ing some­one is there is crit­i­cal too!

    @Suddenly Slim­mer — that’s the beauty of “let it flow”. Life comes with ups and downs…believe me, some days it’s hard for me to flow (but Lance didn’t ask me about my “bad days”! Lance said it best — we’re all in dif­fer­ent places…and the beauty of that is we can learn from each other. Dif­fer­ent places doesn’t nec­es­sar­ily mean fur­ther ahead! Thanks for stop­ping by my blog today.

    @Evelyn Lim — My goal is to inspire peo­ple to more than fit­ness. Well­ness and well-being is so much more. Fire­walk­ing wasn’t so bad, come on keep it on your list!

    @Dot — Thank you and I look for­ward to hav­ing you join the Let it Flow com­mu­nity. There are some new to me blogs here today that I look for­ward to read­ing more about, too! And I agree, there is a lot of power in nature.

    @LifeMadeGreat — Thank you for reading!

    @Stacey — I think it is the name…I don’t often find women who spell Stacey like we do! Thank you, thank you…and I love where you are going, too. We all inspire each other, I believe!

    @Vered — thank you…those three words so often for­got­ten. Or so it seems.

    @Sagan — mod­er­a­tion is key, isn’t it? You’re right, it’s not just exer­cise that we become obsessed with. I’m head­ing to Jamaica next week for more zip-lining!

    @Laurie — for me adven­ture = excitement…but I had to start with small adven­tures and work my way up! Go for it and then let me know how it goes. :-)

    @Annette — I felt the same way about the quote — Lance picked a good one and I’m a big fan of nature. Thank you for read­ing today.

    @Tom — Thank you — one of the things I worked on long and hard over the past three years was “being real”. Cor­po­rate turned me into some­one I “should” be. What an awful feeling.

    Stacey Shipman´s last blog post..Back to Your Senses Sun­day: Do You Let the Weather Stop You?

  16. @Jannie — The F word is a killer and a hard one to take away…Sometimes it comes back, and then I need help remem­ber­ing what to do with the experience!

    @Karl — thanks for adding me to your fee­dreader. I love the name Work Happy Now — why not, right? Athough admit­tedly, going out on your own isn’t all sunny days! You just have more “con­trol” over how things unfold…

    Stacey Shipman´s last blog post..Back to Your Senses Sun­day: Do You Let the Weather Stop You?

  17. brandi says:

    first, thank you SO MUCH for your kind words on my blog. Know­ing that John’s story is get­ting out there and touch­ing peo­ple is heal­ing for me.

    sec­ond, I love this!! I so love read­ing about other blog­gers and what advice they have, what their expe­ri­ences are, etc.

    brandi´s last blog post..in the end, all we have is each other

  18. Daphne says:

    This was a very inspir­ing inter­view, Lance and Stacey. I liked the way Lance left a com­men­tary in sev­eral places — made the whole post come alive. And of course Stacey her­self was so hon­est and frank that it’s endear­ing even for some­one like me who doesn’t know her at all. Great going!

    And the Grand Canyon is on my list too!

    Daphne´s last blog post..Why Are We So Attached To Desired Outcomes?

  19. Audra Krell says:

    Great, inspi­ra­tional inter­view! I enjoyed this very much. It never fails to amaze me, that often things that we think are “good” like exer­cis­ing, can eas­ily become an addic­tion and an obses­sion. I’m so glad you faced your fears and I’m sure you are the health­i­est you have ever been. Congratulations!

    Audra Krell´s last blog post..Team­work Works for Me

  20. Mike King says:

    Great inter­view and as usual, Stacey you have con­tin­ued to impress. I like how you’ve high­lighted the won­der­ful com­ments and added your own per­sonal expe­ri­ence to some of the com­ments as well Lance.

  21. Lance says:

    @Stacey Ship­man — Stacey, you’ve been an awe­some addi­tion here today — thank you!!

    @Brandi — Your wel­come, and again, I’m sorry for your loss Brandi. And, I’m glad you enjoyed the inter­view here today — it was a lot of fun to do (get­ting to know Stacey was pretty cool)!

    @Daphne — I really had so much I wanted to say to all of Stacey’s responses — doing that right after each answer seemed like a great place. I think it did work well too — glad you enjoyed that addi­tion! And, yes, Stacey’s hon­esty was really quite refresh­ing — one of the many things I really appre­ci­ate about her. So, maybe I’ll see you at the Grand Canyon then!!

    @Audra — There is such a thing as “too much of a good thing”!! I was this way when I first started out down the road to a healthy lifestyle — in fact, if I recall cor­rectly — my fam­ily called me obses­sive! Of course, I didn’t see that at the time — I just saw me as being “gung ho” and really com­mit­ted to a healthy lifestyle — when in real­ity, I was reach­ing a point where I just should have been com­mit­ted!! Thank you, Audra!

    @Mike — Stacey’s doing lots of thing right, isn’t she Mike! I think we can all learn some­thing from her. It was fun to inter­ject a bit of my mus­ings along the way! And, Stacey and all the peo­ple who have left com­ments today are what really make this sto­ry­line come alive. Thanks for stop­ping by Mike!

  22. what a won­der­ful inter­view! I am def­i­nitely head­ing over to Stacey’s blog to read, thanks for intro­duc­ing her to me!

    work­out mommy´s last blog post..Con­fes­sion time

  23. Maya says:

    Great inter­view Lance.
    I came here yes­ter­day morn­ing and then went off to Stacey’s web­site — where I got lost :)

    I am really grate­ful that Stacey talks about mind­ful fit­ness and well­ness. I think a lot of peo­ple do not under­stand that fit­ness is not fit­ness unless it is mind­ful :)

    And I think I like Stacey a lot already — jig­saw puz­zles, rock climb­ing, time in the arcade and belly danc­ing — I think I would enjoy an evening with Stacey doing all the things I love! It is won­der­ful to know you Stacey — I look for­ward to talk­ing more with you !

    Maya´s last blog post..A Sim­ple Hap­pi­ness Equa­tion: A Picture

  24. Mark says:

    Lance and Stacey, A fan­tas­tic post, nice to learn more about you Stacey! Lance great job with the com­men­tary! :)

  25. Marelisa says:

    Hi Lance, Hi Stacey: It seems to me that Stacey is very focused, knows what she wants, and that she steadily moves in the direc­tion of her goals. What a great approach to life! And stand up com­edy, wow, that takes a lot of gump­tion :-)

    Marelisa´s last blog post..Fun, Whim­si­cal Gift Ideas for Cre­ative People

  26. Lance says:

    @Workout Mommy — Thanks! And, def­i­nitely check out Stacey’s blog — it’s an excel­lent source of infor­ma­tion on well­ness and inspiration!

    @Maya — Thank you Maya! Lost at Stacey’s blog — I know why — there just so much good stuff there to get lost in!! And, Stacey really has some var­ied activ­i­ties she enjoys — sounds like you have an affin­ity for the same ones — that’s very cool!! Me…I think I bet­ter stay away from the belly danc­ing! I’ll leave that to you two!!

    @Mark — Thanks, Mark! The added com­men­tary was really fun for me to add in!

    @Marelisa — Hi Mare! I tend to agree — Stacey really has a great approach to life! The stand up com­edy bit…that DOES take gump­tion! (I’m not ready for that one either!)

  27. Did my tired eyes deceive me or did she say fire­walk­ing! Wow! That takes like Super­man con­cen­tra­tion or some­thing, doesn’t it?

    Great inter­view, Lance and Stacey, thanks!

    Jamie Simmerman´s last blog post..Santa’s Sur­prise

  28. Lance says:

    Jamie, your eyes do not deceive you! Fire­walk­ing!! In this case, Super­woman con­cen­tra­tion — and I think Stacey may just have that!! Thanks, Jamie!

  29. @brandi — Thank you for read­ing and I agree, it is nice to get to know peo­ple bet­ter this way!

    @Daphne — thanks, I liked Lance’s com­men­tary, too! The Grand Canyon is an incred­i­ble place!

    @Audra — isn’t it true how the “good” can in fact become “bad”. Mod­er­a­tion is key! Yes, in fact I am the health­i­est I’ve ever been. Thank you for read­ing the interview.

    @Mike — Thank you!

    @WorkoutMommy — I look for­ward to hav­ing you visit my blog — thanks for stop­ping by!

    @Maya — let’s get together! I do not know many peo­ple who also enjoy all of those things! Nice to know you are out there!

    @Marelisa– Stand up com­edy does take gump­tion — It’s my 2nd go around due to a failed first attempt!

    @Jamie — I don’t know if it’s super­man con­cen­tra­tion but con­cen­tra­tion, focus and know­ing when it’s right are key to a suc­cess­ful walk!

  30. Arswino says:

    Lance, great job to you for car­ry­ing out this inter­view.
    Stacey, thanks for shar­ing your won­der­ful expe­ri­ence.
    I got a lot of pos­i­tive things here, truly inspi­ra­tion. Thanks again to you both.

    Arswino´s last blog post..Bend, but Don’t Break

  31. Lance says:

    Arswino, thank you! Stacey is really an inspi­ra­tion to me! Her words always make me ques­tion and think deeper. I encour­age you to visit her site, she is an amaz­ing person!

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